Is B-Team the new FTB?

[ScooterinAB]

I've been messing around with Attack of the B-Team for about a month now and I'm having a lot of fun. It's a far more positive experience than when a friend of mine was running a Feed the Beast-Direwolf20 server, since the mods (save for Witchery, which makes me stroke out just looking at it) are a lot more straight forward and less about setting up one machine so you can set up another in order to set up a third.

 

Thinking about the mods, updates, and running a server of my own, I started wondering if B-Team has sort of become the new FTB, for good and bad reasons. The modpack has gotten pretty popular, and it seems like everyone and their dog is starting to play it. It's certainly seems like it's one of the go-to packs around, where as FTB packs were all the rage when I started (also Hexxit, but that's about it). There's quite a bit that can be done with different mods, such that the play experience isn't always going to be the same.

 

Now for the bad part. Since 1.7 was a massive update and seems to be something of a divisive subject in modding, I wonder if B-Team is the new FTB in the sense that the pack is stuck in 1.6.4 and can basically never be updated. Many mods (in general as well as in the pack) have 1.7 versions in the works that will replace 1.6.4 versions. Looks at Enhanced Portals. The version in B-Team is totally different than the version the mod maker is working on right now. I understand the same is true with a planned update to Galacticraft and at least a few other mods. I've also read that some modders have taken 1.7 as a chance to step back from modding, meaning that many mods simply won't be getting updated past their current iterations. This leaves modpacks like Attack of the B-Team is a weird limbo, not terribly different from the RedPower situation with FTB.

 

I should point out that updates for me aren't about the latest and greatest; it's about longevity. Modded Minecraft can be a lot of fun, but if it exists for too long outside of Vanilla, you run into risks of mods no longer being maintained or the entire play experience becoming too different and detached from Minecraft. Even if you remove the version itself from the equation, the mods themselves will only be supported and bug-fixed for so long if mods are tied to an older and older version of the game.

 

What do you guys think? I hope this doesn't come off as "trolly," because that isn't the point. I'm looking at starting a server for some friends and was thinking B-Team, but my fears that this could turn into FTB all over again almost immediately are holding me back.

[Kalbintion]

I've been messing around with Attack of the B-Team for about a month now and I'm having a lot of fun. It's a far more positive experience than when a friend of mine was running a Feed the Beast-Direwolf20 server, since the mods (save for Witchery, which makes me stroke out just looking at it) are a lot more straight forward and less about setting up one machine so you can set up another in order to set up a third.

 

This is commonly done though for progression sake, if you were able to make everything all at once, what fun is that? There is no progression there.

 

 

Thinking about the mods, updates, and running a server of my own, I started wondering if B-Team has sort of become the new FTB, for good and bad reasons. The modpack has gotten pretty popular, and it seems like everyone and their dog is starting to play it. It's certainly seems like it's one of the go-to packs around, where as FTB packs were all the rage when I started (also Hexxit, but that's about it). There's quite a bit that can be done with different mods, such that the play experience isn't always going to be the same.

 

Gotten popular because of the people who created it and their subscriber count, do you honestly think it would have achieved the popularity without known youtubers not only creating the pack, but playing it with other known youtubers? Same goes for FTB and Hexxit. Youtubers brought popularity to them, and the mods just made them content worthy. Have you ever seen any modpack get popular through the mods used in them?

 

 

Now for the bad part. Since 1.7 was a massive update and seems to be something of a divisive subject in modding, I wonder if B-Team is the new FTB in the sense that the pack is stuck in 1.6.4 and can basically never be updated. Many mods (in general as well as in the pack) have 1.7 versions in the works that will replace 1.6.4 versions. Looks at Enhanced Portals. The version in B-Team is totally different than the version the mod maker is working on right now. I understand the same is true with a planned update to Galacticraft and at least a few other mods. I've also read that some modders have taken 1.7 as a chance to step back from modding, meaning that many mods simply won't be getting updated past their current iterations. This leaves modpacks like Attack of the B-Team is a weird limbo, not terribly different from the RedPower situation with FTB.

 

All modpacks will suffer the same fate, they will eventually be unable to update due to mods themselves not all updating to the same version, modders leave, etc.

 

 

I should point out that updates for me aren't about the latest and greatest; it's about longevity. Modded Minecraft can be a lot of fun, but if it exists for too long outside of Vanilla, you run into risks of mods no longer being maintained or the entire play experience becoming too different and detached from Minecraft. Even if you remove the version itself from the equation, the mods themselves will only be supported and bug-fixed for so long if mods are tied to an older and older version of the game

Exactly my point above, plus, all good things must come to an end, eventually.

[ScooterinAB]

This is commonly done though for progression sake, if you were able to make everything all at once, what fun is that? There is no progression there.

 

 

 

Gotten popular because of the people who created it and their subscriber count, do you honestly think it would have achieved the popularity without known youtubers not only creating the pack, but playing it with other known youtubers? Same goes for FTB and Hexxit. Youtubers brought popularity to them, and the mods just made them content worthy. Have you ever seen any modpack get popular through the mods used in them?

 

 

 

All modpacks will suffer the same fate, they will eventually be unable to update due to mods themselves not all updating to the same version, modders leave, etc.

 

 

Exactly my point above, plus, all good things must come to an end, eventually.

 

I should clarify what I meant about FTB and machines. I found that most of the technical mods (also Thaumcraft) simply fueled themselves without actually adding anything. You simply make one machine in order to make another machine. Thaumcraft, for example, added a ton of content, but everything I did in Thaumcraft was in order to get something else in Thaumcraft, but didn't actually get me anything in the end. To me, that isn't progression because I never got anything out of it. With mods like Tinker's Construct, on the other hand, there are progressively better tools, but I'm getting something out of it the entire way. Another example is Thermal Expansion. Further progression into the mod creates more efficient machines and power generation, but any power generation solution is still a valid solution (I haven't gotten too much further into the machines part beyond smelting and basics like that). I never felt that with FTB; only the endless cycle of the next thing just for the sake of the next thing.

 

Regarding updates, sure, everything comes to an end eventually, as no mod will be updated forever. My concern isn't with "eventually" though. My concern is with "sooner than later." My concern with starting a B-Team server is that I'm walking into it with an expiry date. I'd be starting the server knowing that mod developers have either moved on or moved away and that I probably only have a few weeks of play time before we start having the same problems and discussions we had when playing FTB. As I said, I'm having a great time playing B-Team, but I don't know if I want to create a server that I feel has weeks of life before we need to decide if we want to continue or update. Or are my fears largely unwarranted?

[planetguy]

Chances are B-Team won't be able to update to 1.7 without severe breakage. Chances are that almost no other pack will, either - I don't think it's ever happened in all of Technic's history, and I doubt FTB or anyone else has, or could, pull it off except by including only half a dozen mods and having tons of good luck.

Edited May 14, 2014 by planetguy

[Roversword]

Welcome to the world of Minecraft where we still wait for some-sort-of-standardised-API for mods.

Once THIS happens, chances are that existing mods may survive more vanilla minecraft updates before going stall or abandoned or unsable, etc.

 

Since every (major) update of Minecraft (vanilla) introduces new features and usually breaks any kind of compatibilty with the mods, they are either abandoned (which means you can still use them of older minecraft versions -> see tekkit lite, tekkit classic, etc.) or they are likely going to rewritten completely and therefore offering usually much different experiences as before.

Now the modpacks, as you surely have recognized yourself, are made with hundred and more mods (Tekkit 1.2.9.c has 109 if I recall correctly). To change the underlying minecraft version all of those mods need to have a version which works with this new minecraft version AND need to work together in a preferably bugfree way.

 

The last point you made (about longevity) and not being about the newest and greatest confuses me.

Tekkit Classic still works and can be played. Those mods (and minecraft) are rather old. The mods are not supported anymore? So what...as long as they are not absolutely bug riddled there is no reason why that matters.

Since you do not need the greatest and latest, there is no reason to use the latest versions. Stick with Tekkit Classic or Lite. They work, they are not absolutely buggy (there will always be bugs, also in new versions of mods, no matter what).

So you basically asking for older mods for older minecraft versions still being maintained? I am not sure if modders can be motivated to do that...bugfixing maybe if you are lucky...but new features very unlikely.

 

TL;DR: It is in the nature of volunteering work (and minecraft with its unstable API) that modpacks will get old and it takes usually a lot of time and effort from a lot of people to make sure to have an updated pack (which will be outdated immediately anyway). The "FTB-"-experience you mentioned will happen eventually with every single modpack (or even mod).

[Malryth]

I don't really know much about programming.  I just observed that a lot of modders only kept their mods updated to 1.6.4 and never bothered to keep up with the newer Minecraft builds.  It's not too bad going backward from the current version to 1.6.4 for the sake of mods.

 

I applaud all the mod makers that have worked with the Attack of the B-Team modpack to keep adding to and updating their mods to work with 1.6.4.

 

My secret wish is to have Ars Magica 2 added one day.  I don't know if it will fit the theme and feel they wanted for Attack of the B-Team.  I just think it would be a good counter measure for those annoyed with Not So Friendly Witches.

 

It is by no means easy to level up fast (I'm playing around with it in a seperate game).  I have read on the forums though, that it has problems working with Tinkers Construct (specifically the smelter).  Unless the creater of AM2 is willing to work with the Attack of the B-Team group I don't think it will happen.  I can dream though.

 

Again...much thank and gratitude to all the mode makers that have made Attack of the B-Team such an amazing experience.

[Loader]

The issue with AM2 is that it takes away from the sciency feel of the game - with witchery at least it feels like you're building up items mostly, making potions and that kind of thing with only a little bit of magic (infusions).

 

AM2 would be an indispensable mod if it was in, you just wouldn't be able to compete with other players if you didn't use it - that limits the options for most people rather than adding to them as you'd have less available time once you'd worked on the 'must do' mods.  It integrates nicely with witchery from a technical standpoint, but makes a bunch of witchery options pointless from a gameplay perspective (you can resist the damage from infusions with just ars magica magic resistance for example).  I'm not sure it'd be worth bothering with witchery at all if AM2 was in (at the moment it's debatable, usually it's something you'll do if you're interested or have extra time).

 

The balancing in this modpack is fascinating - it's more balanced as time spent by player against the fun of what they're working on rather than against the actual efficacy of the thing they're working on (it feels well balanced when you look at it like that).