Using Pneumatic Tubes.. without timers? (Possible?)

[Vaygrim]

I have come to the realization that, when running Tekkit Lite in SSP, my game "hitches" briefly every time a Redstone Timer within 10 blocks of me 'ticks'. I am not sure if it is the sound of them ticking or what, but it has taken me some extensive troubleshooting to figure that the timers were the source of the trouble. This normally wouldn't be a big issue except for the fact that I LOVE pneumatic tubes and Red Power machinery used with them. The "assured delivery" and "no overflow / spill out" features are extremely important to me. This means that I actually have about 6 timers in my base at any given time.. all pulsing Filters and Transposers.

That brings me to my current conundrum: Is there a way to use Pneumatic Tubes and Red Power machines.. without providing redstone pulse via timer?

[Kiwionrails]

You could use a sorting machine, it has a mode where it will pull out without the need for a timer

Also you could use relays to input from BC etc pipe networks :)

[Random Encounter]

Item detectors will emit a redstone pulse, or individual red stone pulses.

Regulators will emit a constant redstone signal when it's connected device has the listed amounts it maintains. It will also pulse when it ejects an item into it's connected device.

Relays automatically push out any items into a connected pipe without a redstone pulse. However they cause an update on any pipe network connected to them.

Managers can pull and eject items without a redstone pulse.

Many of the RP2 blocks can work inline if another device is pushing items somewhere in the network towards them.

[Vaygrim]

Okay apparently there are a TON of RP blocks that I was not even aware of: RESEARCH TIME!

Thanks for the suggestions, everyone!

[xtrasyn]

a buffer will auto pulse any filters or transposers (every 5 sec, but every 500ms when it's full or nearly full) you connect directly to it. Since you can attach both BC pipes and RP tubes to your buffers, I'm sure you can figure something out. It will cost an additional block here and there spacewise, but it is a sexy solution.

[Vaygrim]

a buffer will auto pulse any filters or transposers (every 5 sec, but every 500ms when it's full or nearly full) you connect directly to it. Since you can attach both BC pipes and RP tubes to your buffers, I'm sure you can figure something out. It will cost an additional block here and there spacewise, but it is a sexy solution.

Well technically I have to have an adjacent block right now ANYWAY because I need space to place and aim the timer. So.. the second block is just being moved inline.

That sounds like an AWESOME solution (the Buffers). I need to look those things up.

[xtrasyn]

http://thetekkit.wikia.com/wiki/Buffer_(TubeStuff)

Here you go. There is another buffer so don't mix them up. :)

[xtrasyn]

Reading that I was probably incorrect about the transposers (they aren't named explicitly, anyway) but I don't use them much. Filters have that bit of extra awesome (at the price of doped wafers, but yeah okay).

[Vaygrim]

I try to specifically always use Filters as they pull whole stacks (whereas Transposers only pull individual items) of things. This keeps my buffer chests from clogging up! I really do love the Pneumatic Tubes from Red Power, but I wish I could figure out WHY timers are hitching my gameplay so badly. Everything runs smooth as silk.. until I get within 10 blocks of any timer.

Last night I started exploring BuildCraft Pipes to see if there was a viable alternative that still had overflow protection, and discovered the Insertion Pipe in the process. The Insertion Pipe resolves my overflow issues, but with the added frustration of TRIPLING space dedicated to pipes so you can funnel the overflow back to the origin point. Combining this with Autarchiac Diamond Gates I was able to make a Buildcraft pipe test system with overflow that required no Redstone engines AND didn't go into an infinite overflow loop if the target chest was full.

Real proud of myself. But again.. it takes up three times the space of a simple Red Power pneumatic tube setup. SO. I need to figure out buffers!

[xtrasyn]

You should try insertion pipes on Barrels. Since they take only one item, you can run an entire line of insertion pipes over them without loss of space. That or the Deep Item Starage from minefactory reloaded (takes only one type of item as well, i think).

[Industrial Miner]

I have a few options here for you.

RP Sorting machine: It can sort automatically, but it requires power.

RP Filter with Item detector at the back ( MUST use a redstone tube between filter and item detector: When an item flows through, the item detector will pulse, which will let the filter pull again. Set a timer of 10-30 seconds to reactivate.

Filter-Buffer-Filter combo: This will auto-pull depending on how full the buffer is and thus doesn't require reactivation.

InputChest (wooden pipe) to RP Relay: Won't require pulses or power, but when the items clog up in the relay, items will get spilled by the wooden pipe.

[Vaygrim]

I have a sorting machine system that does NOT use a timer (since someone pointed out the "Auto Mode" that self-pulses"). VERY nice setup. Unfortunately the entire system is pulling from an Ender Chest, which allows me to carry an Ender Bag with the same color key and grants me the ability to remote insert items into my sorting system for automatic processing and storage.

For whatever reason, the Sorting Machines do not treat the Ender Chest as a "valid storage chest" type, so if the Ender Chest is directly next to the Sorting Machine.. nothing happens. The items pile up and nothing ever gets pulled. If I have a Filter pull from the Ender Chest into a "Diamond Chest" (which the Sorting Machine does treat as valid storage), then everything starts working. This means I have to have a timer giving a pulse to only the Filter.

So.. should I run some wooden pipe with an Autarchic Gate on it from the Ender Chest to a Buffer .. which then directly connects to the Filter and the rest of the system? Or what?

[Industrial Miner]

Well, it could be possible to use an autarchic gate, but I think the autarchic gate would detect both the conditions of the Enderchest and the Diamond chest. So if the one has space but the other one doesn't, the autarchic gate would still pull, or maybe not. It's a bit hard. My solution would be to pump items into a relay with an inline Sorting Machine.

[Vaygrim]

Relay. Relay.

Time to start messing with Relays.

If anyone else has more bright ideas, I WELCOME THEM!

[xtrasyn]

Oh yes ofcourse. The redpower relay.

Sorry, that was the best option.

[BLAZE MkIV]

Use the autarchic gate to activate the timer that controls the filter so its only running when there are items in the ender chest? So it may be a high speed setting but it only ticks infrequently?

[xtrasyn]

The real problem I suspect (because I recognize this problem) is probably that eloraam made every timer a separate entity. If she would code a series of running clocks corresponding with the timer settings that every timer would 'tap in' to it would mean every timer that runs on a setting of 2s is actually just one process.

Not that I know anything about stuff like this but using timers in great numbers really hogs so I was just thinking out loud really. :/

[milonti]

So I may be out of touch, but dont redstone engines (and other buildcraft engines) activate redstone? Otherwise you could always build an old-school timer out of vanilla minecraft pieces and wirelessly transmit the signal.

[Vaygrim]

So I went rummaging across the web and dug up several consistent suggestions regarding reducing lag:

• Use Pneumatics in place of BC Pipes whenever possible (this I already favor)
  
• Don't use Redstone Timers (which are normally considered 'required' for Pneumatics, heh)
  
• Use Insulated Redstone Wire instead of bare Red Alloy Wire whenever possible. (Apparently the notion is that since the wire lights up, every block length it stretches across is a block that has to be 'updated' by the server. Since Insulated versions do not light up, this problem is eliminated.)
  
• Replace redstone timers with a single redstone timer hooked up to a Wireless Redstone Transmitter, then use Wireless Redstone Receivers every place you need a 'pulse'. (This is stupid expensive but I'm at a point in a single player game where I could at least start testing this to see if it helped. I made one timer set to 1 second, and hooked it up to a wireless transmitter, called it the "Master Tick". Every other place I needed a pulse, I just stick a wireless receiver next to it and tune it in to that frequency. The wireless receiver does light up, but not enough to register as a "light source", and it also has no animation or accompanying sound to it as the timers do.)
  
• Replace Crystal Chests with Diamond or Obsidian Chests. (I never use Crystal Chests anyway as I already knew they lagged out my game on multiplayer servers. I just use Diamond or Obsidian.)
  
• Don't use Wrath Lamps. (This is all theory, no one can actually PROVE they cause lag as of yet. The idea is that they impact such a massive area with their light, and that they themselves each have particle animation inside them, getting rid of them and replacing with lumar lamps or glowstone / torches. I only had ONE Wrath Lamp as they are so expensive, so I just took it down. This wasn't an issue.)
  
• Don't use basic IndustrialCraft solar panel units, only use arrays. (I already have all of my solar units as LV arrays, so that isn't an issue.)
  
• Don't use World Anchors / Chunk Loaders (or at least try to restrict their usage).
  

There are more items that could be added onto the list, but these are the most popular and most often mentioned. I did everything on this list, if it wasn't already done and I still have the same problem. If I get anywhere within 10 blocks of the middle of my base, I get this horrible hitching and 30 FPS. Anywhere else in the world map and the game runs smooth as glass, 75 to 80 FPS. Still investigating the problem, but Redstone Timers may actually NOT be the source of the issue.

[warpspeed10]

If all else fails, you can simply use a vanilla clock too.

[Vaygrim]

So I finally got OptiFine working with 0.5.9 of Tekkit Lite (silly me, I was attempting to copy it into the wrong JAR file!). Let me tell you.. the difference in performance is night and day.

WOOOOOSH!

[xtrasyn]

So I went rummaging across the web and dug up several consistent suggestions regarding reducing lag:

• Use Pneumatics in place of BC Pipes whenever possible (this I already favor)
  
• Don't use Redstone Timers (which are normally considered 'required' for Pneumatics, heh)
  
• Use Insulated Redstone Wire instead of bare Red Alloy Wire whenever possible. (Apparently the notion is that since the wire lights up, every block length it stretches across is a block that has to be 'updated' by the server. Since Insulated versions do not light up, this problem is eliminated.)
  
• Replace redstone timers with a single redstone timer hooked up to a Wireless Redstone Transmitter, then use Wireless Redstone Receivers every place you need a 'pulse'. (This is stupid expensive but I'm at a point in a single player game where I could at least start testing this to see if it helped. I made one timer set to 1 second, and hooked it up to a wireless transmitter, called it the "Master Tick". Every other place I needed a pulse, I just stick a wireless receiver next to it and tune it in to that frequency. The wireless receiver does light up, but not enough to register as a "light source", and it also has no animation or accompanying sound to it as the timers do.)
  
• Replace Crystal Chests with Diamond or Obsidian Chests. (I never use Crystal Chests anyway as I already knew they lagged out my game on multiplayer servers. I just use Diamond or Obsidian.)
  
• Don't use Wrath Lamps. (This is all theory, no one can actually PROVE they cause lag as of yet. The idea is that they impact such a massive area with their light, and that they themselves each have particle animation inside them, getting rid of them and replacing with lumar lamps or glowstone / torches. I only had ONE Wrath Lamp as they are so expensive, so I just took it down. This wasn't an issue.)
  
• Don't use basic IndustrialCraft solar panel units, only use arrays. (I already have all of my solar units as LV arrays, so that isn't an issue.)
  
• Don't use World Anchors / Chunk Loaders (or at least try to restrict their usage).
  

There are more items that could be added onto the list, but these are the most popular and most often mentioned. I did everything on this list, if it wasn't already done and I still have the same problem. If I get anywhere within 10 blocks of the middle of my base, I get this horrible hitching and 30 FPS. Anywhere else in the world map and the game runs smooth as glass, 75 to 80 FPS. Still investigating the problem, but Redstone Timers may actually NOT be the source of the issue.

Do you have a lot of items in transit?

I once had this plan to build a massive cube and put all transport tubes in the walls of it. Anyway, bottom line, the lines were stupidly long and the time between a request and its fullfilment was insane. So I started to approach it differently and make all transport very generic and simple. The moment anything has to send back an item all the way to its origin because the destination is a fail and machines start up storing stuff and timers keep pounding it... I don't know. I always took that to be the reason for a lot of lag. As soon as i started to use failproof systems (chest, or restriction pipe, anyway, out of the system where it has to be 'tracked' and in to the 'chest statistics' as soon as possible if you catch my drift) and well closed loops with really short lines (aiming for nigh direct request fullfilments) it all worked a lot better.

So your problem could be design based. :/

Funnily it's an argument for people defending buildcraft pipes. They both have their advantages. For items in transit and requests buildcraft kinda owns redpower, lagwise.

Ah, what the hell. They both rock. :)

[Vaygrim]

I have an array of 12 chests, each tightly compacted into as small a space as possible. The pipes are all hidden behind a wall with just the chests poking through, and the sorting machines for them (6 machines total) are one floor directly above. The distance stuff has to travel is extremely minimal, even if something has to circulate through the whole system.

Plus.. this odd 'hitching' that I am getting happens all the time, even when there are zero items in transit.

[Gazaka]

Plus.. this odd 'hitching' that I am getting happens all the time, even when there are zero items in transit.

I have the same problem and associated it with RP redwire pulses, it always starts with that (Nope not using stupid .2 sec timers). I did try to make a video of it but FRAPs dies when it stutters about like that. If I knew what it was I'd help out a bit more. Until something official is noted by mods etc then I will just keep testing various things to get my game working smoothly again. Currently using 0.5.7 and would use Optifine as a test but not even sure on the Forge build used in 0.5.7 and if it's even available.

[xtrasyn]

If its not the timers then it must be retrievers or the filter animation.

Heck it could even be the sounds. Didn't ic2 suffer from that as well?