Server Economies

[cmwatford]

Just a thread for discussing ways of dealing with things like currency and so forth on a server.

I know most people disable ee on servers because it's devastating to the local economy but I think if you disable energy collectors and possibly condensers ee can make for some amazing trade items. Imagine actually having to make dark/red matter by hand and using it as a sort of condensed currency. Sort of like iron being a small currency similar to dollar bills with red matter being similar to thousand dollar bills.

Naturally you'd want to keep the p stone out of the hands of most players so I guess you'd need some kind of setup that would allow players to exchange the necessary materials for the next step up without giving them access to potentially destructive tools.

[joe5]

unless you completely and i mean completely gut the entire transmutation system their is nothing you can do to prevent people from getting infinite materials.

[cmwatford]

unless you completely and i mean completely gut the entire transmutation system their is nothing you can do to prevent people from getting infinite materials.

That's kind of the point of not letting anyone have a p stone or condenser.

[joe5]

are you prepared to disable the transmutation table?

[cmwatford]

Not sure how they'd get one without the p stone but even if they did they'd still have to do quite a bit of work to get anything of value out of it and that's really the point isn't it?

[littleweseth]

Still allowing the Transmutation Tablet? Hello, extremely large cobble farms! (The same applies to cobble feeds for IC2 scrap generation.)

There's a reason why I restrict the number of cobble generators each player is allowed to have.

[Xylord]

Still allowing the Transmutation Tablet? Hello, extremely large cobble farms! (The same applies to cobble feeds for IC2 scrap generation.)

There's a reason why I restrict the number of cobble generators each player is allowed to have.

Well, to be honst, UU-matter is a bit of a pain in the ass without scrap generators. An alternative could be a quarry, but I don't think the big rape holes are worth it.

[cmwatford]

I know some servers disable cobble gens for that exact reason. I know one in particular that made cobble gens produce glass instead of cobble. I had a good laugh at that. Really hate the idea of disabling the tablet because it's very useful for getting those things that are hard to find or keep stocked up on. But i guess it could really kill an economy. Especially if those hard to find things are considered valuable.

[littleweseth]

I know some servers disable cobble gens for that exact reason. I know one in particular that made cobble gens produce glass instead of cobble. I had a good laugh at that. Really hate the idea of disabling the tablet because it's very useful for getting those things that are hard to find or keep stocked up on. But i guess it could really kill an economy. Especially if those hard to find things are considered valuable.

Supply and demand is the basis of all economies. Allowing the transmutation tablet removes resource rarity entirely, meaning that your demand for a rare resource can be satisfied by your own supply of a common resource. Say you need gold, but all you have is iron; on an EE-enabled server, you just convert the iron into gold using the transmutation tablet. Without EE, you either have to go find some gold yourself, or trade for it.

--

In a UUM based economy with no equivalent exchange, we have the strange situation where uranium, silver, nikolite, and the coloured gems (emerald, sapphire, ruby) are in demand, and hence valuable, because they can't be made from UUM. Ditto leather, ender pearls, and blaze rods, which are incredibly highly priced because the only way to get them is by farming cows, endermen, and blazes. New players make a killing on hand-gathering these resources and selling them to the established players.

My personal cash cow is mass-farming IC2 stickreed crops for rubber. You can make sticky resin from UUM, but I farm it in bulk and sell it a little bit cheaper than the UUM cost of the sticky resin. I also value-add by doing the sticky-resin -> rubber processing before sale. I trade rubber by the thousands, at a handsome profit.

--

The other interesting thing about my server's economy is that I didn't control it - it started off as a barter economy ("I'll trade you 64 rubber for 16 iron"), but quickly evolved to using UUM as a currency for all the same reasons that currencies evolved in early history:

"IEEE Spectrum' date=' June 2012 - 'A Brief History of Money'"[/url']

Let's start with what money is used for. Modern economists typically define it by the

: 


It’s a store of value, meaning that money allows you to defer consumption until a later date. 


It’s a unit of account, meaning that it allows you to assign a value to different goods without having to compare them. So instead of saying that a Rolex watch is worth six cows, you can just say it (or the cows) cost $10 000.


And it’s a medium of exchange—an easy and efficient way for you and me and others to trade goods and services with one another.


A Minecraft server is a very interesting social experiment.

[cmwatford]

Wow that's pretty interesting. I tend to forget that gold is actually useful for things in tekkit lol. I was thinking of a currency based in iron where gold is the next step up in the currency followed by diamond, followed by diamond blocks, ect. Disable the dark/red matter tools and then dark/red matter are just used like large bills.

[LeninTheRed]

Great info on this thread. I think i'll go ahead and just disable EE based on some of this info.

\

[finton]

I too face this problem, i want to remove EE but people want to use it and I risk loosing players.

Is there a way to disable certain items that are used in the condenser?

[logoster]

yes, get the tekkit restrict plugin for bukkit and then go to the config and choose the items you want disabled

[Aritchey]

yes, get the tekkit restrict plugin for bukkit and then go to the config and choose the items you want disabled

Let the topic die...

[gavjenks]

Edit: Didn't realize this was necroe'd by the guy above me. My post was irrelevant at this point.

[VideoBoy]

Supply and demand is the basis of all economies. Allowing the transmutation tablet removes resource rarity entirely, meaning that your demand for a rare resource can be satisfied by your own supply of a common resource. Say you need gold, but all you have is iron; on an EE-enabled server, you just convert the iron into gold using the transmutation tablet. Without EE, you either have to go find some gold yourself, or trade for it.

--

In a UUM based economy with no equivalent exchange, we have the strange situation where uranium, silver, nikolite, and the coloured gems (emerald, sapphire, ruby) are in demand, and hence valuable, because they can't be made from UUM. Ditto leather, ender pearls, and blaze rods, which are incredibly highly priced because the only way to get them is by farming cows, endermen, and blazes. New players make a killing on hand-gathering these resources and selling them to the established players.

My personal cash cow is mass-farming IC2 stickreed crops for rubber. You can make sticky resin from UUM, but I farm it in bulk and sell it a little bit cheaper than the UUM cost of the sticky resin. I also value-add by doing the sticky-resin -> rubber processing before sale. I trade rubber by the thousands, at a handsome profit.

--

The other interesting thing about my server's economy is that I didn't control it - it started off as a barter economy ("I'll trade you 64 rubber for 16 iron"), but quickly evolved to using UUM as a currency for all the same reasons that currencies evolved in early history:

A Minecraft server is a very interesting social experiment.

Leather? LOLWUT. Cobble generator -> scrap -> scrapbox -> deployer -> infinite all sorts of shit, including leather. And diamond.

[gavjenks]

Leather? LOLWUT. Cobble generator -> scrap -> scrapbox -> deployer -> infinite all sorts of shit, including leather. And diamond.

Nothing that you mentioned in your post involved UUM.

The person you quoted said "can't be made from UUM." You even bolded it, yet still didn't read it...

The reason why that matters is that with UUM, you choose what you want, whereas your cobble generator will take a ridiculous amount of time to make any useful amount of leather or whatever UUM doesn't make. You have to generate about a stack of cobble for a scrapbox, which takes about 2 minutes, and then you have like a 1 in 500 or whatever chance of getting what you want. So to get a stack of leather you'd have to run a single cobble gen for about 64,000 minutes, or over a month of real life time...

[jojomoep]

To be honest i think its not really possible to run a kind of economy on a tekkit server. Even with disabled or very limited EE.

In the end UU-Matter has the same impact to the economy as collecters, relays, condensers have.

You can pretty much get everything you need - more then you need out of uu matter and your matter production will exponecially grow.

And your point of "there are items with no UU matter recipes for" doesnt really count for me, cause its pretty much only leather, uranium and enderpearls.

Uranium, you dont really need it there are lots of ways to get energy even faster, cheaper and with less effort.

Leather, do you even need it?

Enderpearls, you dont really need them in high ammounts and if you got some armor and good weapons, you can just go to the end for some minutes to get them.

In the end the exponetial growing of the UU gain will destroy any sense of trading, cause no one really needs something that he cant produce by himself.

Economies in tekkit are just not possible cause everyone has the access to the same recources, there is no way to specialise on someting and try to sell stuff.

For example, lets say how it is in reallife, there is someone who can make bread, another one who builds machines and another one whobuilds houses.

In Minecraft/Tekkit its just that everyone can do everything. So you dont need to worry about buying bread from someone else, cause in the end its just a few clicks away. Or you won't hire someone to build a house for you cause where would be the fun living in someone elses stuff.

Really the only thing that you could actually sell in tekkit is knowledge and even that is limited, pretty much everyone knows the basics. The only knowledge you might be able to sell is about, lua programming on cc, or setting up logic gates setups.

And even those two things are explaind a thousand times on wikis, youtubes or other stuff all over the internet.

In the end tekkit economy will not be more then "i give you 10 iron for a stack of rubber".

[pixlepix]

On parsonage, which has the best managed economy I've ever seen, I found a way to make a profit. I crafted redpower items and sold them for tons of money. As they are fairly easy to craft in bulk, rich players would pay when they needed some, not wanting to waste their time.

[Bangers]

On parsonage, which has the best managed economy I've ever seen, I found a way to make a profit. I crafted redpower items and sold them for tons of money. As they are fairly easy to craft in bulk, rich players would pay when they needed some, not wanting to waste their time.

Ha yeah, I've made a good profit on servers before by setting up solar panel factories. People pay large amounts for the luxury of not having to do much work :P

[VideoBoy]

Nothing that you mentioned in your post involved UUM.

The person you quoted said "can't be made from UUM." You even bolded it, yet still didn't read it...

The reason why that matters is that with UUM, you choose what you want, whereas your cobble generator will take a ridiculous amount of time to make any useful amount of leather or whatever UUM doesn't make. You have to generate about a stack of cobble for a scrapbox, which takes about 2 minutes, and then you have like a 1 in 500 or whatever chance of getting what you want. So to get a stack of leather you'd have to run a single cobble gen for about 64,000 minutes, or over a month of real life time...

Tell that to the 3 diamond chests full of leather I've got in my base... and that tube that goes into an incinerator burning several stacks of it a day that I made because I didn't have more room for more diamond chests. Mass scrapbox fabrication is faster than UU matter.

On a different note - TekkitCustomizer (a plugin) disables UU matter recipes for ores and some other items. Shame you can't disable your own recipes, though, as copper and tin are still there.

[poryy]

I too face this problem, i want to remove EE but people want to use it and I risk loosing players.

Is there a way to disable certain items that are used in the condenser?

You BETTER not delete it >:(