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If you are interpreting maintenance to mean "breaks/stops randomly no matter what," I agree with you on large systems. But then you're factoring out MFR biofuel, or other forms of process-based renewability, and those are all fine. The issue is a single block which is place and forget forever.

I interpret 'maintenance' to mean an artificially added mechanic which cannot be automated, to force players to spend time on the system after it's been constructed. I don't mind if the automation is somewhat complex: I built rather complicated reactor setups for IC2, and enjoyed the design and implementation. However, I *do* mind when the setup cannot be automated, such as when MFFS added 'forcicium' because they didn't want people to be able to run force fields indefinitely. It doesn't matter if you can mine it, you can't automate the mining (without frames), and thus you can't automate the system.

I'm not sure where that falls among your definitions, but that's how I see it.

The new Big Dig will have galacticraft, and it's not going anywhere (it's mah baby).

That's good to know. I confess that the new splash art for it had me worried: I was beginning to believe that it was being viewed as for lazy people or whiners, and thus I was afraid it might be in danger of falling to the wayside.

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Since we're onto renewables (yay) I've thought of some suggestions on game-play balances. For solar, it should be height-based--the lower you are, the less energy you're getting from the sun. Gives people a good reason to run up a mountain. (In space, I think we can remove the height requirements, but add some wear & tear from micrometeorite impacts.)

Since someone's gonna bring it up sooner or later, people will eventually want to work with wind and/or water power. Both should run off a Crank Engine, which is really a conduit of its own. For wind, height determines how many blades you can attach to the back of the engine--from two to four. (Obviously we need to let people color them, as a future fun thing.) And for water, a paddle-wheel to the back under some falling water, obviously. The higher the water is falling (simple check for air above a column of moving water) the more power the paddle-wheel outputs, with an appropriate cap to prevent 250-high waterfalls.

For nuclear... well, I definitely recommend a multiblock structure. Precisely how I'm not sure; do we want it heat-exchanger based or steam-pile based? Both have different setups to consider.

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Speaking of nuclear, I would love a multiblock LFTR. I can imagine a core block holding uranium and molten thorium/fluoride salt flowing around it in pipes. You'd setup exchangers at few places to filter the newly bred uranium into the core and heat exchangers hooked up to some sort of steam turbine. Yes I've been thinking about this for a while.

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And fusion reactors. Or even antimatter reactors. :D

If I had leet modding skills, I'd probably make a Treknology mod with very high-tech themed machines, on the level of Applied Energistics.

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Okay then, I offer a compromise to the solar issue.

  • They need to be affordable enough to be built by folks who've been playing for X period of time, and not capable of becoming end-game/game breaker.
  • They need to have some sort of requirement to remain in continuous operation.
  • The maintenance can be automated.
  • Multiple steps in the making of component tiers meaning its tedious to manufacture.
  • Utilize multiple machines in the fabrication process.
  • Utilize advanced alloys

Heat Cells: Fuel

Nether brick and Nether quartz dust - seeing as they come from the nether, they're going to be able to either hold a lot of heat and/or resist it. Neither of these two are necessarily easy, or difficult. Heat cells are like water cells, except solids. Over a period of time the heat cells build up heat (durability loss). To replenish their durability, placing them in the TE liquid transposer.

How am I doing so far?

Solar Heater: Component

Machine block, a redstone reception/transmission coil, a bit of electrum, possibly nether brick, and a focus aperture.

Focus Aperture: Component

Machine block, but replace gold with diamond and Iron with Silver.

Thermal Generator: Component

Machine block, lead, silver and/or copper, with a piece of invar to simulate a shaft for the motor.

Like it so far?

Solar Generator: Final product

Componets:

  • Solar Heater
  • Focus Aperture
  • Thermal Generator
  • Invar ingots down the each of the sides for the hull
  • 2x Vanilla Daylight Sensor at each top corner

Pros:

  • Sustainable, clean energy
  • 1MJ to 8MJ output

Cons:

  • Can break if all heat cells are not replaced (Unit shuts down until all heat is completely removed)
  • Has to be fed water for internal steam generation
  • Peak output from 10:00 to 14:00 hours
  • Variable output based upon sunlight
  • Rain prevents operation

How does this sound?

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Tekkit has Biofuel? No offense but that's news to me. The whole thing with IC2 for me is that MJs aren't easy to design for as EU Tekkit doesn't even have Forrestry or Railcraft. I may not be as active in the open mod community but I know both these mods and they both have very good buildcraft style engines as well as Forrestry having sustainable fuel sources. There comes a point where the player feels like you're banning the stone pickaxe on him. Stuff needs to be achievable for people to continue playing. P.S. I know about the history between tekkit and forrestry but what other mod has the sustainable power of forrestry?

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MFR is the massively obvious one. Well, except forestry is not sustainable anymore, since the farm multi blocks require apatite, so MFR is actually sustainable forever, unlike forestry. And yes, tekkit has biofuel. The only real ability that has been removed in the newest tekkit are RP2 frames, nothing can replace them yet. Everything else, has a replacement. You just need to look at the 60 something mods included in tekkit, instead of obsessing over the two, IC2 and RP2, that were removed for several compelling reasons. The biggest reason being that they don't update for months on end, and thus including them isn't even an option that is available, and probably won't be for months, if ever.

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Everyone seems to have their opinions and offer that the current state of Tekkit is fine the way it is, but honestly I enjoyed the buildup of IC2's solar arrays (since you need quite a number of them to produce enough power) as well as utilizing Energy Bridges to power my quarries and other equipment. I really enjoyed Power Converters despite how some deemed them inefficient.

I also wanted to note that I see a lot of upset in the Tekkit community while FTBers already have a strong movement going and carry a lot of bias towards Tekkit. Honestly, from a server admin standpoint, it scares me that I might have to eventually migrate to FTB simply because Tekkit keeps reinventing the wheel, especially when I already have so much vested in getting my server going with Bukkit plugins.

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I also wanted to note that I see a lot of upset in the Tekkit community while FTBers already have a strong movement going and carry a lot of bias towards Tekkit. Honestly, from a server admin standpoint, it scares me that I might have to eventually migrate to FTB simply because Tekkit keeps reinventing the wheel, especially when I already have so much vested in getting my server going with Bukkit plugins.

Tekkit has Minecraft 1.5 right now... This minute... When Minecraft 1.6 comes, I am confident that Tekkit will have a 1.6 version shortly after. FTB is still on 1.4.7. In fact, FTB will likely be stuck on 1.4.7 until several weeks after the release of 1.6!

That is why I left FTB and am now on Tekkit. I could manage all the mods myself, but I prefer to have a modpack to keep me up to date and sanitize the configs. I also like being able to find new people to play with just by knowing they play Tekkit, not finding out which version of MFR they have and what build of Forge they are running. Modpack platforms let me focus on the fun, Tekkit gives me the most recent version to have fun with. So, for the last several weeks I have been a Tekkiteer and, while I don't want the beast to starve to death because I think multiple pack platforms is good competition, I don't really care what FTB is doing if they are not going to move forward until 1.6.

This is from a Slowpoke post from the FTB forums on May 5th 2013:

... Having said that' date=' the final versions of 1.4.7 Ultimate, Direwolf20 and Mindcrack packs are in final testing right now. Essentially these contain several mod updates to their final 1.4.7 versions and in the case of the Mindcrack pack the mod Bibliocraft will be added in. Unless something critical comes from somewhere, the next updates to any of these packs isn't expected until several weeks after the release of 1.6 at the earliest. ...[/quote']

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@Scotty D: Yes, this is also why I refused to run FTB. For well over 8 months, they ran the same versions and implementations as tekkit classic. Even as tekkit classic updated theirs, FTB remained broken. Tekkit lite was released, FTB was still 1.2.5. They were more interested in schmoozing convention goers than churning out code. I understand vacation, but 8 to 10 months of inactivity? I'd fire my staff for shenanigans like that.

But I digress. You cant make everyone happy, and frankly, I'm happy to see IC2 gone from a long-term standpoint (The water bucket duping exploit - free iron for everyone). This gives me greater challenges to overcome.

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I also wanted to note that I see a lot of upset in the Tekkit community while FTBers already have a strong movement going and carry a lot of bias towards Tekkit. Honestly, from a server admin standpoint, it scares me that I might have to eventually migrate to FTB simply because Tekkit keeps reinventing the wheel, especially when I already have so much vested in getting my server going with Bukkit plugins.

You've heard of the Platform right? It's a thing we made. It's no longer us or them. It is now us or anything you want. If you don't like the direction the stock packs are going, you don't have to pack up your server in a depressing hobo bindle and mournfully walk down the road to FTB. You can customize and use the Platform to make sure your server is perfect forever. 83 thousand platform packs means people are getting the idea. Get on the trolly youz!! :colbert:

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To all the haters.

Just download the latest test version of IC2, smack it in the mod folder and use it.

and FIY, seems they removed LV MV and HV solars. might be temp or permantent. I didn't bother reading the changelogs.. Didn't know they were from an addon..

I just want the mod for the late game stuff like uu matter and to test out what's new.

People should just stop complaining. Yes, IC2 is a good mod, but it's not in this version of tekkit, and neither will it. get over it! move to another custom pack or go play vanilla.

and just stop comparing this pack to FTB. If you like it so much, stick to it..

/thread.

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You've heard of the Platform right? It's a thing we made. It's no longer us or them. It is now us or anything you want. If you don't like the direction the stock packs are going, you don't have to pack up your server in a depressing hobo bindle and mournfully walk down the road to FTB. You can customize and use the Platform to make sure your server is perfect forever. 83 thousand platform packs means people are getting the idea. Get on the trolly youz!! :colbert:

You are completely right. I guess my post was tainted from a lot of frustration trying to get mods and plugins to play nice last night. Custom Platforms it is!

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Yeah, way too much work for the end-user. Custom zips was a step in the right direction, but the platform is downright amazing, especially with the Solder API.

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while I don't want the beast to starve to death because I think multiple pack platforms is good competition

Except there really isn't any competition. I don't know about FTB, but the devs here seem to just be focusing on doing their own thing without regard for what anyone else is doing. They just want to make the funnest packs possible. That is a good chunk of the reason I prefer technic to FTB. The stuff in technic packs get in based on its own merits, not whether some other pack has it or doesn't or whether its popular or not. Changes are made to improve the pack.

And yes, the platform is amazing. Why have a handful of packs, when you can have a zillion packs, some of which could be your own? Brilliant logic.

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Well and we wouldn't mind seeing some tough competition come out of the platform itself. If FtB want to put their packs on the platform, advertise their packs hard, keep their own website, and use our launcher to push their stuff, that's great. If they become the highest-rated packs on the platform and we're advertising FtB on our front page, that's excellent. If they want to fork our launcher so there's like, a feed the beast launcher that loads their packs by default instead of ours but you can add platform packs to it, that's awesome too. That's the whole point of putting the tools in the hands of the people, more people can do what we're doing and get new great stuff out there. If FtB's attitude is, "our stuff is better than yours", we don't mind that. The only atittude I won't put up with is the old "oh modpacks are for idiots, screw modpacks make everything yourself by hand".

So there's not really any animosity here, more packs is more better, and every pack that's competing with us just vindicates our position all along that getting prepacked mods into the hands of the masses lets everyone enjoy minecraft more. Nothing lasts forever, maybe one day another pack will bury us. The impact we've had on the way minecraft is played will outlive Technic, though, and that's the best part, and that's what the Platform is about.

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You just proved my point, yall are good people who want to do good things. As long as the community as a whole wins, it doesn't matter who gets it to the win.

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I wonder in what kind of state the modding scene would be if Technic never existed? Would FTB exist? Would mods work wonderfully together like they do now?

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I wonder in what kind of state the modding scene would be if Technic never existed?

We would probably still be living in the stone age of modding, with mods not being able to play nice with each other.

Would FTB exist?

No, FTB was created as a rival to Technic.

Would mods work wonderfully together like they do now?

Probably not. Technic has done a lot more for the community than many people think or care to admit.

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We would probably still be living in the stone age of modding, with mods not being able to play nice with each other.

Not likely.

Minecraft had a massive problem just waiting for a solution, which Kaker and co. filled nicely. But it was inevitable someone else would have tried if technic hadn't escaped confinement.

No, FTB was created as a rival to Technic.

No, FTB was created to service that annoying challenge map. They just exploited anti-technic hate to quickly build a fanbase.

It would have existed anyway.

Minecraft without technic is all just a big What If that can never be answered. So lets enjoy what Is instead of ponder on what Could Have Been.

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No, FTB was created to service that annoying challenge map.

Yes, but IIRC, Slowpoke said that one of the main reasons it was created was to rival Technic. I think Teraku is talking about the whole launcher ordeal instead of just the map though. And if Technic didn't exist, there would be no anti-technic fanbase to have, so a whole launcher with different modpacks would probably not exist.

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